[LUAU] Ubuntu... Legalities

Tue Jun 6 08:13:40 PDT 2006

My point was that most folks will pay for convenience. Most folks will pay 
for a Linspire or Mandriva edition because it has all the conveniences built 
in (i.e. an autoplay DVD player, etc.). As far as marketing crap I believe 
you way oversimplified it. If people will pay for it you now have a business 
model.

You nailed it with your statement about valuing freedion over market share. 
The only folks in that boat are the folks with the technical know how, time 
and drive to make a FOSS product work (highly intelligent guys like 
yoursself). Can you put together a Debian or Ubuntu, et al system for free? 
Yes. Will the majority of folks in the world take the time to do it and 
troubleshoot it when it breaks? No. Not because their time is not free but 
because they can pay Mandriva $129 and get a working system out of the box 
and when it breaks they can contact somone to fix it.  That is worth $129 
and that is why Mandriva is succeeding.

As far as Wi-Fi being free. Who are you kidding? There is no such thing as a 
free lunch. Here in Hawaii the old boys all want a cut. It will never be 
free here. I ran into a guy the other day who is proposing totally free 
Wi-Fi. Heh, it's supported by driving folks to his website to buy products 
and services (and the hotels are resisting because if someone buys something 
from the website while on hotel property, they want a cut) and if it doesn't 
work (i.e. make his site more profitable)? It'll shut down. There is going 
to have to be some kind of business model to support  free hotspots. 
Bandwidth and equipment cost money and I don't see any companies lining up 
to donate either.

MD
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jim Thompson" <jim at netgate.com>
To: "LUAU" <luau at lists.hosef.org>
Sent: Monday, June 05, 2006 10:17 PM
Subject: Re: [LUAU] Ubuntu... Legalities

>
> On Jun 5, 2006, at 8:12 PM, Maddog wrote:
>
>> Jim,
>>
>> One point I think most of the FOSS community misses is that it's  great 
>> if you have the technical knowhow to find, install and  troubleshoot 
>> these free softwares. The majority of users in the  world either don't 
>> have the time, or don't have the expertise to do  that or simply would 
>> rather point and click. Probably why Linspire  has half a chance to get a 
>> foothold in replacing Windows XP
>
> From what I can tell, (k)unbuntu is as easy to drive as linspire,  and 
> costs less.
>
>> If you had a choice to buy gas for $3.35/gallon right down the  street on 
>> King Street or drive to Millilani (if you live in town)  and pay 
>> $3.09/gallon, where would you most like fuel up? A large  majority would 
>> go to the more expensive station out of convenience.
>
> I think you'll find they're "better off" paying the $3.35/gallon at  the 
> local station.
>
> Lets say you've got a car with a big tank, perhaps 20 gallons, and  you 
> manage to arrive in Millilani with 1/4 tank or less, so you can  manage to 
> squeeze 16 gallons in on your fill-up.   You've "saved" 16  x ($3.35 - 
> $3.09), or $4.16 on your fill-up, and you had to drive to  Millilani and 
> back.
>
> Google says its 17.9 miles from Lionel's 76 at 1505 S King St,  Honolulu, 
> HI 96826
> to the Chevron a t95-130 Kamehameha Hwy, Mililani Town, HI 96789
>
>  If you burn just 1 gallon of gas, (your car averages 36 mpg, which  I 
> find unlikely) you've only saved $1.07, and you have yet to  consider what 
> your time is worth.  (Google says its 30 minutes each  way.)   I find it 
> more likely that your car gets around 22mpg, so it  cost you $5.05 in gas 
> to drive to Millilani and back.   Even if you  manage to arrive running on 
> fumes (with an empty tank) you've spent  $5.05 to "save" $5.20.
>
> This doesn't even make sense if you're driving something that holds a  lot 
> of gas, because most of these vehicles guzzle gas.
>
> GM rates Hummer H2 at 10-13 mpg.  The Ford Expedition gets 14-19 mpg,  and 
> the three-quarter ton Chevy Suburban gets 13-17 mpg.
>
> The standard H2 holds 32 gallons, the Expedition holds 28 gallons and  the 
> 3/4 Ton Suburban holds 26 gallons.   We'll assume that you can  manage to 
> arrive in Millilani running on fumes (impossible with these  fuel injected 
> engines, and same will shorten the life of the fuel  pump, but I digress, 
> and give you the benefit of doubt.)
>
> Suburban: 26 * $0.26 = $6.76 fuel savings, cost to drive to/from 
> Mililani: $6.51
> Expedition: 28 * $0.26 = $7.28 fuel savings, cost to drive to/from 
> Mililani: $5.82
> H2 32 * $0.26 = $8.32 fuel savings, cost to drive to/from Mililani:  $8.51
>
> at the other end of the scale:
>
> Prius 51mpg (highway) and holds 11.9 gallons.   $3.09 fuel savings,  cost 
> to drive to/from Mililani: $2.17
>
> Keep running the numbers, it starts to make sense to drive to  Millilani 
> if your car holds about 100 gallons of fuel.
>
>> There are societal issues that prevent FOSS from becoming dominant. 
>> Maybe if Linux distributions concentrated on that they would be  able to 
>> infiltrate the market to a higher degree.
>
> Conquering the market (especially while sweeping freedom under the  rug) 
> is the stance taken by many "open source" advocates.   Others  (including 
> Free Software advocates) value freedom over 'market share'.
>
>> I think the new wireless models have taken notice, free with lots  of ads 
>> or pay a bit for no ads. We'll see if it works but as I  recall an ISP 
>> tried that without success.
>
> unlicensed wireless will only succeed when its free ($0 cost).   I  say 
> this as the former CTO of Wayport (a for-pay "hotspot" ISP), with  a lot 
> of wireless experience ever since.   Point in fact, we sell  gear to a lo 
> of folks who are trying to install for-pay wireless.
>
> I think any forced ads will be quickly defeated.
>
>> Maybe a combo FOSS and for pay model works? Mandriva seems to live  by it 
>> and judging by the bottom line they have had some success.
>
> There is value in support, and there is money in customization,  because 
> nobody's time is "free" (at least, not all the time).
>
> As for the "Windows vs. Linux: The Great Battle" stance, it is very  much 
> a Marketing Myth. The only people who believe this myth are  people who 
> are susceptible to believing marketing crap.   I've found  that companies 
> trust suppliers who respect their choices.   That cuts  both ways.
>
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