[LUAU] s/hosef.ics.hawaii.edu/mirrors.hosef.org/g

[Jimen Ching]

On Mon, 18 Dec 2006, Jim Thompson wrote:
> Attempting to define LUAU is like trying to hold water in your fist.

When you make the statement "LUAU is HOSEF", you're attempting to define 
LUAU.  I must then ask, why are you attempting to do something that seems 
impossible?

>> I've cared about the direction of the LUAU mailing list for a long time. I'm 
>> sure the archives will show that I've voiced my opinions on the matter on 
>> many occasions.  If that proves me to be childish and petty, then so be it.
>
> And what action(s) have you taken?

'Voice my opinion' as mentioned in the qouted text.

> If you review the history carefully, the "former managers" had checked out.

May I ask what the point of this statement?  There are managers now, 
right?  So why bring up former managers?  Are you trying to say something 
about the current managers?

> LUAU is also essentially the same people who are involved with HOSEF.

This is one of the issues I have.  Not everyone in LUAU is involved with 
HOSEF.  Thus, saying LUAU is HOSEF isn't fair to these people.

> Yes, you can attend the next HOSEF board meeting.   Its tomorrow night.

Looks like I missed the meeting.  I think I only need to meet with Scott, 
as the issue I have is really between me and Scott and not the entire 
HOSEF board.  The HOSEF board didn't make any statements.  Scott did.

> Do you want to suggest an agenda item, or were you coming to listen?

I have no issues with HOSEF or with its board members.  I'm mainly 
concerned about the LUAU mailing list and the hardware supporting it.

> You are free to 'fork' the list, and always have been.
> You are free to copy the archives of the list, and always have been
> You are free to post messages to the LUAU list and tell the assembled there 
> that you have a different list (you can even name it LUAU, though its 
> obviously not going to be <luau at lists.hosef.org>.  Those you invite are free 
> to join in.

What are you trying to say with these suggestions?  You want me to fork 
the list?  I certainly don't need you to tell me what I'm free or not free 
to do.  So please, come out and say what you really mean.

> You have always been free to do these things, but there is a reason you have 
> not.
>
> You may wish to explore same.

So I have a reason for not forking the list?  Ok, now I'm curious. 
Please enlighten me.

>> I know when I joined LUAU, I joined LUAU, not HOSEF.
>
> You limit yourself unnecessarily.  Why?

Because I don't see it as a limitation.  I see it as freedom to choose 
what I want to involve myself with.

>>> Interesting.  Your volunteer time to help Julian and Vince administrate 
>>> LUAU is always welcome.  Your time to install the soon-to-be donated hard 
>>> drives would be appreciated.  No individual has the ability to dump LUAU.
>
> Did Scott say anything about HOSEF?   No.   He said, "Your volunteer time to 
> help Julian and Vince administrate LUAU is always welcome. "   You responded 
> with a red herring.  Why?

Sorry.  My comment was specifically responding to the hard drive thread, 
not to the "help Julin and Vince" part.  My bad for not editing my qoute 
better.  Actually, I did kind of mention the hard drive thread.  You just 
cut my paragraph apart, so it make me sound like I said something I 
didn't.  Still, I should've edited my qoute better.

>> If I understand the hard drive thread, that's about mirroring of 
>> distributions.  I do not believe LUAU as a mailing list will be 
>> significantly impacted by this.  But if it is, I'm willing to purchase the 
>> necessary equipment to make it independent.
>
> Does the local mirroring of distributions not help those who are
> interested in the topics appropriate for LUAU?

It is appropriate.  Did I say otherwise?  Matter of fact, any HOSEF 
related topic is appropriate for LUAU.

>> I've been a member of LUAU long before HOSEF.
> This doesn't mean you are being civil or respectful.

Ugh, ok.  You're misqouting me, again.  Matter of fact, I was trying to 
say I wasn't being civil or respectful at all.  That's what the rest of 
the paragraph was trying to say.  But you cut it apart.  And in doing so, 
changed the meaning.

>> And now I'm being told that since I don't provide the time and money to 
>> maintain it, I don't have a say in the direction of LUAU.
> You've been told no such thing, of course.

It's my interpretation of what was said.  Granted, I may have 
misinterpreted the comments.  I hope that's what happened...

> No "organization" posts here.  We are all individuals, and I doubt that many, 
> indeed if any of us think we represent an organization when we post here.

I don't know if you know this.  But organizations don't make posts.  The 
officers of the organizations make the posts.  When such an officer makes 
a post, he or she needs to say whether they are speaking for the 
organization or for themselves.  When no such disclaimer is made, one has 
to assume.  Which leads to misunderstandings.  I'm sure that's what has 
happened here...

> I don't see you taking any positive steps.

Whether the steps I'm taking turn out to be positive or not will depend on 
whether I succeed or not.  Only time will tell.

--jc
-- 
Jimen Ching (WH6BRR)      jching at flex.com     wh6brr at uhm.ampr.org