[luau] Proposed LTSP Server Config

[Hawaii Linux Institute]

Wow, this is EXCITING!  (I apoligize for not trimming the quoted 
comments; the information contained in these two threads was simply too 
valuable.)

Yesterday, I had breakfast with Honolulu city councilman Rod Tam, who 
chairs the city council's business development committee.  He indicated 
that he will push a proposal aimed at making Honolulu the "Linux capital 
of the world" (as part of the multi-billion-dollar Kaka'ako Waterfront 
development project).  Don't laugh at this idea.  Let's face it, what 
other options do we have?

Rod and I have been talking about "growing" Linux in Hawaii for quite 
some time, since when he was chairman of Hawaii Senate's business 
development committee.  I am an outside legal counsel to the national 
research laboratories of Taiwan, which, in addition to its $500M annual 
R&D budget, also serves as the incubator of Taiwan's high tech industry. 
  After many failed attempts to interest some of my clients to set up 
their manufacturing plants here (now you can really laugh at this idea), 
it becomes patently clear that the kind of high-tech industry that has 
any chance of growing roots--and creating jobs--on our islands must be 
software-based, and it must also involve internet and services.  And 
when you mix the three ingredients--software, internet, and service, 
they magically turn into a 5-letter word: Linux.

There is also another urgent reason to consider Linux.  Microsoft 
Windows has become inherently insecure.  I am not talking about virus, 
worms, or whathaveyou--most sysadms think they can handle these problem 
(until it gets out of control, of course).  The problem is that, in 
order to continue to sell Windows to the Chinese government, Bill Gates 
has agreed to open Windows' source code to the Chinese government.  
While most Americans, especially those in Hawaii, don't think about the 
dire consequences, most major private Chinese have been avoiding Windows 
like plague.  Of course there are other articulable reasons, but I have 
noticed that many giant financial institutions such as Fidelity, Charles 
Schwab, CitiCorp, First Boston, Morgan Stanley Dean Witter, etc., have 
recently switched to Linux.  Coincidence?  While this move can be 
attributed to their UNIX roots, many actually had been talking about 
switching to Windows servers.

However, in order to have any chance of our city (and eventually the 
state) adopting Linux, there must be application tools that can do the 
chores that are now being done with Microsoft Office and WordPerfect.  
The fact that OOo can now be loaded in less than 10 seconds is certainly 
a big plus.  But whether we can quickly develop a reliable user 
experience database (for OOo) and compile a list of functional 
equivalants, holds the key to the next step.

Anyway, thanks for the info, Warren.


Wayne



Warren Togami wrote:

>On Fri, 2003-09-19 at 21:06,
>Michael_Bishop/FARRINCS/HIDOE at notes.k12.hi.us wrote:
>  
>
>>I am just starting to build a full blown LTSP lab at our school and I
>>would
>>appreciate any feed back or ideas about the purchase of our server.
>>Please
>>take a minute to look at our server config.
>>
>>It will run K12LTSP RedHat version, IceWM, StarOffice 7, Mozilla and
>>The Rosetta Stone.
>>
>>I expect this to support at least 50 thin clients running The Rosetta
>>Stone ( http://www.rosettastone.com ) on WINE. As well as allow
>>students to surf
>> the net and type out letters.
>>
>>I know this config might seem like over kill. However, I expect to be
>>running WINE on at least 20-30 thin clients at a time.
>>
>>Summery of server: Dual AMD Opteron 240s 1.4Ghz, 4GB RAM, 4 x HD SCSI
>>15K 73.4GB, RAID 0+1, 1Gig Fiber connection.
>>
>>This is a quote from CDW-G. However they won't provide a warranty. Do
>>you know of any vendors that build and offer warranty and support?
>>
>>Tyan Thunder K8S (S2880GNR) Extended ATX Motherboard  1  $510.00 
>>$510.00
>>AMD Boxed Opteron 240 Processor  2  $325.00  $650.00
>>SIMPLE 1GB PC2100/PC266 DDR REG  4  $370.00  $1,480.00
>>Enlight Server Case 8950 System cabinet  1  $510.00  $510.00
>>Adaptec SCSI RAID 2120S RAID  1  $410.00  $410.00
>>    
>>
>
>If you plan on ever running it in 64bit mode, do not buy this card. 
>Both of Mid-Pac's Opteron servers have a similar card.  The driver is
>not 64bit clean (it seems that it is broken on any 64bit Linux), and
>thus broken.  It seems that Adaptec has no plans on fixing it too.
>
>However, if you run only 32bit Linux this card works fine.  Mid-Pac's
>Opterons are running 32bit Linux currently because of this Adaptec
>driver problem.  Later this year Red Hat Enterprise Linux for AMD64 (and
>IA64) will be released... I think it will be version 3.0 but I am not
>sure.  If I had a working 64bit SCSI RAID card I might be able to take
>advantage of the speed boost of Opteron running in pure 64bit, but it
>seems I am stuck.
>
>  
>
>>ENLIGHT ULTRA3 SCSI HOT SWAP MOD  1  $265.00  $265.00
>>Seagate Cheetah 15K.3 Hard drive  4  $675.00  $2,700.00
>>
>>    
>>
>
>How large are the hard drives?  May I recommend saving money and buying
>two drives running in RAID-1 rather than four for RAID-0+1.  You will
>not see much of any benefits for the thin clients with 4 instead of 2
>drives.
>
>However, if you intend on using this server as a file server for other
>labs too, then the four drive combination will be well worth the money. 
>Otherwise you would have better thin client performance by kicking up
>the processors to 242 or 244 with the money you saved from two fewer
>disks.
>
>  
>
>>Grand Total $6,772.60 with shipping
>>
>>Thank you.
>>
>>Michael
>>    
>>
>
>Liholiho Elementary and Mid-Pac bought roughly the following machine for
>LTSP.
>
>  
>
>>MicroVault 5002 Tower  $2341.00
>>GOLD Service Plan (3 Years Labor, 3 Years Parts).
>>In-Win IW-Q2000 ATX Tower 300W P.S..
>>Upgrade from 300 to 400Watt Intel/AMD PS.
>>Enermax UC-8FAB 8cm Case Cooling Fan.
>>Tyan S2880UGNR Dual AMD Opteron DDR266/333 Ultra 320 SCSI G-bit LAN
>>Video.
>>Two AMD Opteron 240 Server CPU.
>>Two Coolermaster SK8-7I53A CPU Fan.
>>Two 1GB Micro Pro PC2100 DDR266 ECC Registered.
>>    
>>
>
>Your double RAM will certainly be a benefit.
>
>  
>
>>Mitsumi 3.5" Floppy Disk Drive.
>>Two Fujitsu 36.7GB 10K-RPM Ultra320 (68-Pin) MAP3367NP.
>>Adaptec 2010S U320 SCSI Zero-Channel RAID Card.
>>52x24x52 CD-RW IDE Drive, Mitsumi CR-52XETE.
>>    
>>
>
>MicroPro had a 3 year parts warranty for $100 at the time.  I disliked
>their service because they were very slow, moving back the shipping date
>by 2-3 weeks and constantly making excuses, but eventually Mid-Pac
>received our servers at substantially cheaper prices than other vendors
>at the time.  Peter at Liholiho had an easier time receiving the server
>when he ordered about a month later.
>
>The prices above were only 2 weeks after Opteron release, so I don't
>know how prices are now.
>
>Peter's server was slightly different, with an "LSI Symbios" RAID card
>rather than Adaptec.  I had not heard of the brand, but apparently it is
>well supported in both 32bit and 64bit Linux and highly recommended
>among some hardware people I know.
>
>You may want to wait at least a week to see how hardware prices shift. 
>IIRC Athlon64 releases early next week, meaning there will be a flood of
>new AMD64 hardware on the market.  While Athlon64 wont be suitable for
>that server, it may or may not effect pricing on the Opteron hardware or
>other generic hardware around it.
>
>Warren Togami
>warren at togami.com
>
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