Linux on the desktop?

Deven Phillips dphillips at viata.com
Thu Apr 19 10:42:10 PDT 2001


George,

	Userfriendliness IS important, but I don't feel it should be at the
forefront. That is the reason that Windows and Mac have become the way
that they are (Unstable and virus proned). Userfriendliness, in some
cases, leads to user stupidity and unstable systems. There will never be
a GUI that can do everything that a CLI can do. All that we can hope for
is enough GUI for the computer illiterate users, and still a CLI for the
people who actually know how to use it. A prime example is the Microsoft
paperclip. They wanted to make their product "more user friendly", and
instead drove millions of people insane with that damned little demon.
So, I guess my point is that there has to be a balance - easy of use vs.
stability and power.

Deven Phillips, CISSP
NEtwork Architect
Viata Online, Inc.

Cyberclops wrote:
> 
> Very well said, but there are other social and political reasons for
> switching to Linux.  I used to be an extreme Mac fan until Apple came
> out with a line of computers that dropped the scsi ports and the ADB
> port which made my good keyboard and mouse unusable on their machines.
> Not only that, but their new machines did not even include an internal
> diskette drive.  As for M$, they seem to be constantly changing their O$
> and in my opinion it has never been all that great.  To me it's always
> been amazing that the industry as a whole so whole heartedly endorsed
> M$. Open source provides freedom of choice.  There are at least 50
> different distributions and this competition is great.  It forces better
> and better product all the time.  Open source provides freedom from the
> tyranny of large corporations, plus freedom from their ups ad downs and
> failures.  One of the most encouraging things is recent news that come
> governments have decided to officially adopt it as their operating
> system of choice.  I feel Linux is close to being ready for the desktop,
> but it does need improvement.  There are things the clubs can do to
> help.  For example we need to maintain some sort of list of video cards,
> network cards, modem cards, and wheel mice that are currently on sale
> and which are know to work easily with most al Linux distributions.
> Secondly, we need to work on a few pass out sheets with really good
> clear simple instructions on how to accomplish things.  That's one of
> the reasons I like Libranet.  Their entire guide is just 9 pages long.
> Clubs need to adopt a mode of thinking where the CLI is not God.  It may
> be good, but it's very scary to start typing in things and you have no
> idea of the function or syntax.  Clubs need to pressure the developers
> of KDE and Gnome and even the Linux kernel developers to put user
> friendliness at the forefront.
> 
> Warren Togami wrote:
> >
> > IMHO, Linux is not yet ready for mainstream desktop use.  Recent advances
> > with GNOME, KDE and Linux office suites have made great strides toward this
> > goal, but Linux still has too many software installation and configuration
> > issues that are simply NOT intuitive enough for the average desktop user.
> > The average desktop user doesn't want to do ANYTHING with a command line
> > interface.  While "power users" love the myriad of options available in
> > Linux, this confuses normal users.
> >
> > I recently showed GNOME and KDE to a Mac power user.  She was not the
> > average luser needing a good beating with a cluestick.  She understood it,
> > but she saw no reason to use it because she already has MacOS and all the
> > software she needs.  This is the same reason why the average Windows user
> > will not be swayed.  They already paid for Windows and Office (or they can
> > get it for "free"...).  You have to step back and think, aside from the
> > curiosity of power users, how do you convince these peoples of the virtues
> > of "Free Software" when they already have software that reasonably does the
> > job (albeit problems that they accept as normal)?
> >
> > Even with powerful tools like Red Carpet and APT, Linux does not have a
> > unified uninstall system like "Add/Remove Programs".  Yeah, it sucks, but it
> > works.  Linux also needs something like Microsoft's Management Console: an
> > abstracted, template based GUI system for administration of arbitrary
> > programs locally or over a network.  There are several attempts at this in
> > Linuxconf, Webmin, and K and GNOME conf, each has their differing
> > capabilities, with no compatibility between each other.  Linuxconf has
> > abstracted modules with a reasonable amount of flexibility, but the
> > interface sucks.  Webmin has similar capabilities, but web only, though with
> > a slightly better interface.  K and G conf have much better interfaces, but
> > they lack an easy abstracted module type of thing present in MMC, Linuxconf
> > or Webmin, and they have no remote capability beyond X.
> >
> > About Linux software - I don't need to explain this so much.  There is
> > plenty... but not enough, especially for specialized business needs like
> > groupware or financials.  This problem is steadily resolving, with more and
> > more companies making software for Linux.  I am not concerned about current
> > and future availability.  I am concerned that too much Linux software
> > requires CLI knowledge, and is not as simple as Point-and-Click.  Until all
> > software installation works like this, Linux is not ready for the average
> > user.
> >
> > HOWEVER, WE CAN MAKE IT READY
> > It will be a few years before unification of standards in these areas will
> > make Linux friendly and useful enough for the average user.  In the mean
> > time, we as the more technical savvy users can configure Linux deskstops,
> > workstations and thin clients for others.  If we go through the installation
> > and configuration steps for them, the software itself is powerful and easy
> > enough for them to figure it its use quickly.  Unfortunately, this takes a
> > lot of work, so this really is only viable in two situations.
> > 1) Pre-loaded on computers.
> > 2) Businesses and schools.
> >
> > (I don't include helping a friend configure Linux on their home computer,
> > because the only people who would want this are power users themselves.)
> >
> > Ok.... this rant is getting too long.  I'll cut it off here.  Not like
> > anybody actually reads these things.
> > I think I wrote the same thing a few months ago in that "Unnecessary Windoze
> > usage" thread...
> >
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